No Connection: Dating During COVID | #tinder | #pof

This week on Margin Call we welcome Bay Area tech worker Patricia as we explore the ups and downs of dating during a pandemic and the things young women should look out for when seeking a potential partner.

[00:00:00] Eming: [00:00:00] Greetings and welcome to Margin Call the podcast and editorial meeting for Kwest on Media. I’m your host Eming Piansay. Now don’t be concerned just because it’s, I’m not Russell doesn’t mean this isn’t a Margin Call episode, I promise. Today’s actually a very special slash different episode. I know we throw around the word special, a lot at margin call, but  I promise this one is, is very special. 

[00:00:38] Today we are talking about dating specifically during, during COVID, because. Personally, I don’t date anymore. I’m in a relationship. So I don’t have that. I don’t have the ability to go do that anymore, but people do and people are doing this. Soo today I wanted to have a very different, [00:01:00] different conversation about it with someone who definitely has the experience of dating during COVID, um, Patricia , who, I guess I should say we are related, it was a little disclaimer she technically my aunt…I always mess this up, aunt  I don’t know. I dunno, whatever, either way Patricia raised in California, but also works for a tech startup and she’s a very. Worldly person, as I would like to say, she’s, she’s seen things. She’s been places she’s always jet setting as far as I can tell.

[00:01:43] Um, I really wanted to bring her on because she always has the most interesting stories to tell. And specifically, in terms of in the dating realm, I figured she would have thoughts, feelings, and maybe some advice for people who are trying to [00:02:00] find love, or just trying to have fun in love or find someone during this time.

[00:02:04] I don’t have a agenda for this conversation. I just kind of want to roll with it and see and see where it went. So Patricia, if you want to start, like, I know we sort of talked about this before, first of all, thank you for coming on. 

[00:02:18]Patricia: [00:02:18] You’re welcome. 

[00:02:21]Eming: [00:02:21] We’ll hopefully have you on more,  soon in the future, but I want to throw it to you obviously, when we sort of,  spoke about dating during COVID.

[00:02:33] No, not during, COVID just dating in general, you had a lot of thoughts and you had a lot of things that you did to kind of like not filter, I would say, but like to navigate the dating realm. So what do you, what do you sort of do if you don’t. 

[00:02:51] Patricia: [00:02:51] That’s a great question. You know, I think there is, I think COVID actually has, uh, added a little bit, , [00:03:00] more complexity as far as the dating world, for those of us, , that are.

[00:03:06] Familiar with going out, you know, hanging out with our friends, maybe, meeting up at a restaurant or a bar. It gives you those opportunities to meet people. And there’s some of us that are in the camp where we do better. If we meet somebody face to face. And I know a lot of folks that rather have that type of interaction, even if you just met the person, because you really can find out a lot more.

[00:03:33] What COVID done, I believe is, you know, all the apps. You all know, you know, it’s the tinders, it’s the plenty of fish, it’s stuff, you know, yada, yada, it just gives you the ability now that we’ve got COVID, it’s kind of the only way to start meeting folks. So what I’m finding is for people that have never had to use apps before that have used friends and bytes and going to restaurants and going to bars.

[00:04:00] [00:04:00] Now, all these. Other folks are in using the apps. And there’s a lot of questions being asked in there, which is kind of interesting. It’s, it’s actually making people, uh, be more real because it is going to be kind of chats in the beginning. And to really know, you know, they say know your non-negotiables, but then it’s also knowing kind of what that looks like on what you’re looking for.

[00:04:30] Eming: [00:04:30] Right. So when you’re, when you’re. Well, let me back up. So out of curiosity, like what’s the app that you find yourself most using right now? 

[00:04:43] Patricia: [00:04:43] Well, you know, it’s Tinder in, in, and I think Tinder was a little bit more wild, but again, for those of us that know kind of what we’re looking for, can you give your first name.

[00:04:55] You do put pictures there. You do give a little bit of a, a snippet of, of what you’re [00:05:00] looking for. What I find is there’s a lot of chatting going on, like just chatting and you want to get, like, I’ve had an invite to go do coffee in then Marina, I’ve had an invite to go down to Monterrey and an invite to go to Los Gatos, to do with masks with six feet.

[00:05:20] You know, positioning, pick up some coffee and take a walk, right? Like you’re still six feet apart. You still have your mask on you’re, you know, you’re trying to be careful, but you also want to get out there and because there’s not restaurants and they’re definitely not letting you hang out at the bar and maybe that’ll come.

[00:05:37] Later this year, there’ll be a free fall during summer, or whenever that opens up, uh, it’s just a different, I will say, what’s what it’s done is it makes, what we’re doing now is really super safe, right? Like we’re putting ourselves out there, but we’re not really like it’s how easy is it just to have a chat conversation with someone?

[00:05:58] Okay. You’re let’s say it’s you and you’re [00:06:00] meeting someone for the first time. You probably are going to dig into a lot of things. Deep conversation and really try to find more about that person, like on a deep level, that’s how some people grew, because then they feel like they know you. That’s kind of a safety net, same when you’re chatting.

[00:06:20] But what I find is the men are more apt to get you to get to the next level sooner or faster. So they’re really going, Hey, I know this is just going to be chat, then I’m out like, okay. You have to start there. Right.

[00:06:41]Eming: [00:06:41] So are you saying like, there are, are these guys like more inclined? Like they want to take the, like to the next level of like, beyond conversation is it like a pure, like physical sexual thing?

[00:06:54] Patricia: [00:06:54] Well, good point. And, you know, we all think it, and we all have that persona. [00:07:00] There was, I mean, maybe this will tie it all in where Tinder was kind of wild. It’s there’s another app for, uh, folks call Grindr right. But Tinder could, when it first started out, it was pretty wild. Uh, what I find is because of COVID people have really reeled it back in like, You don’t want to just go meet someone you haven’t, but that’s not been in your circle with one of the, one of the guys on their goals.

[00:07:24] We need to make Tinder. Great. Again, take it back, take it back to where it was when they first opened up. Like it was. And again, I didn’t use the app then. And the only reason I’m on is because of COVID. Uh, but they said, make Tinder great again, where, you know, they said, as long as you got a request that came in before midnight, you were still. You know, to meet up or drink, which you could, but you can’t with COVID now, right? Who’s off knowing that people aren’t going to really do that, but I’ve been on since January and I’m not an app type person. I will tell you, [00:08:00] I would rather meet people. Face-to-face but I being on the app, let’s say. But say I’m probably chatting with probably anywhere from five to 10 guys at any one time.

[00:08:10] Right? So I wouldn’t have gotten that at home. I’m at COVID I’m working, but I’m not really going out. So now I’m having these conversations that maybe I wouldn’t have had because I was so visual and I did need to meet someone first to feel more comfortable about revealing more stuff about myself, which I’m not going to do on chat.

[00:08:30] And there was this push to. Hey, can I have your number so we can start? I mean, I can chat with you on Tinder. Why would I give you my number? Like I have you, and then you could, you could still balk, but you don’t want to do that. So I find that it’s just chatting, but I feel that the men are frustrated by, by COVID.

[00:08:49] Surely they’re the ones that like to get you, uh, speed things up is what I will say. Speed things up a bit. There was a place in, let’s say Menlo [00:09:00] park, uh, that we all used to go to. And let’s say this was Thursday night. Folks that know where this place is a Menlo  Park Thursday night know exactly what I’m talking about.

[00:09:10] I won’t say the name. And was fun because Thursday night was ladies night and Thursday night she could roll up there and you could have fun now. Or my chickas  and I rolled with my girlfriends. It was just. Fun, like go grab a drink after work and just do Thursday night at this place. And, it was fun.

[00:09:30] What I did find though, was at this place 30 year olds would chat me up, which is great. Right. It was nothing more than a chat. So that’s like, Zoom is for what we’re having to use with COVID Tinder is like the new chat, but women like it because we’re chatting, but men don’t like it because they know it’s just going to be chat.

[00:09:53] Like they’re frustrated that they can’t, it feels like they’re trying to hustle us to get the coffee thing going, [00:10:00] which I would rather, right. I don’t want to chat with somebody for. Four weeks. And then we go meet for coffee and I’m like, eh, it’s not going to work. Right. Or so I have a lot of lady friends that’ll chat with people that they’ve never met yet.

[00:10:16] And they say that that’s dating and I don’t believe it. Dating is when you’re physically with someone you can’t just date over chat. Like you just women think chat is just for chatting, but men don’t, and they’re frustrated by this because women are comfortable with just chatting and if you’re okay, I’m just home.

[00:10:34] [It’s] COVID but the men don’t, they’re trying to speed it up. You’re trying to speed it up a little bit to get to see you 

[00:10:41]Eming: When you are chatting with these individuals over, over the app. Um, are you, are you finding things like, obviously, like you’re, you’re being very careful about how you are meeting these people out in the world and it’s like, you’re not going to be like, Hey, that’s like, you know, be super close right now because it’s [00:11:00] not really safe.

[00:11:02] Are there people out there that you’re meeting who are like not being pushy or like, are willing to like, you know, talk and build through this pandemic, despite the fact that they’re on a dating app and they’re looking for something love or otherwise, is there, are there people out there who are willing to put in the effort and time to talk to you?

[00:11:24] Patricia: That’s a great question. So I’ve been on since January, because one of my  2020 2021 goals was to put myself out there more so that this is how I’m doing it. Uh, to your question, uh, specifically, I’ve had. I’ve had invites to do things. And none of them have come through one, one case, one guy gave me his number.

[00:11:46] I called him, we chatted, we made arrangements to do like coffee, get coffee and walk around the Marina, like see the big bridge or the golden gate. And, uh, chat about stuff uh, and then, uh, [00:12:00] I didn’t hear back from him nor have I, uh, and I had his number, so it wasn’t like a one call. Boom, done. Another person invited me out wanting to do something.

[00:12:09] I think I was going to go to Santa Cruz because he’s in Monterey and, uh, I, it was on me cause I thought, Oh, do I want to do this? Like I just started chatting with this guy. Do I want to meet him? I don’t know. You look through the pictures and the worst picture you find, you know, he doesn’t look better than that.

[00:12:28] They do their high school  picture. And then Tinder has this verified thing. So then, you know, he’s going to be the least close to that. So they give you the picture starting in their thirties, but you dig, you know, and if they’re being honest, you’ll see an original picture or a soon to be one. So I missed the first, I’ll say date that we try to get together.

[00:12:50] Then he came up with actually, I was supposed to go out to Los Gatos to see him tomorrow. Uh, but he has, uh, He’s a [00:13:00] realtor and I guess a big deal came through. And I thought, I dunno, dude, is that, is that going to be, you know, I missed it the first week and okay. That’s on me. Second weekend is going to be tomorrow.

[00:13:12] And he, I checked in with him on Friday, so I didn’t hear anything. We kind of made the plan. And then by Friday I want to play my weekend. If I’m not going to go out with you, I’ll make other plans. Right. And so I texted him. And immediately, he says, you’re gonna gonna hate me. You know, I got a big deal.

[00:13:27] It’s down wherever it is. And it’s, it’s a good opportunity. My broker wants me to, so that what that tells me is think plans we make can be broken by his business. Right. Which I don’t mind, but at that starts, and maybe the reason why he’s on Tinder, that perhaps he’s a realtor and realtors are 24/7, that he’s cute.

[00:13:48] And he looks like somebody I’d want to chat up, whether it turns into just a friendship, whatever. That’s not the point. It’s more like now I’m perceiving that his job. Being a realtor cause your 24/7 [00:14:00] is going to get in the way, like I’m always going to have to go, Oh, that’s right. We made those plans to the symphony or we made those plans.

[00:14:06] Oh yeah, that’s right. But you have a deal that’s coming up. So I’m going to have to always be finding a girlfriend or someone that wants to go when I have planned something. But money’s money. And if you’ve got to deal, go on down and I would be the same way. It’s got a multi dollar sale, which is going to net you a pretty low penny, then dating is, and he actually said yes, and I, I don’t want to read it, but maybe I can preface what he mentioned. 

[00:14:33] Eming: [00:14:33] Just paraphrase.

[00:14:35]Patricia: [00:14:35] uh, what it was and, uh, but he was very nice and even said, I know this is the second time, and now it kind of seems like you’re going to be back. He’s, you know, he says, you know, beg forgiveness, you know, he’s got somebody coming in town, you know, all I understand, I’ll understand if you sense that I am choosing money over you.

[00:15:00] [00:15:00] And I was like, woo. But you kind of are. You kind are choosing and money. So  and I get that, like I tell, and then the other thing I get is they’ll go, wow. You’re, you’re not really on Tinder. Well, Monday through Friday, I’m working 10 to 12 hours a day, easy running marketing for a tech company. And it’s hard for me to be focused on anything other than work Monday through Friday.

[00:15:27] Like I can roll into Tinder, but it’s later at night, it’s like an, it’s not an afterthought, but it’s like something fun to do like Facebook. Okay. Let me roll up here on these 99 guys and that left swipe left swipe. Right. So I in I’m actually, also widening my net of people that I thought I would be interested in knowing this is COVID.

[00:15:52] I started to read more. You’d be proud of me of this. Start to read their bio more than just look at their pictures. [00:16:00] And please, for any guys out there that might be listening to this podcast, don’t send shirtless pecs. That is gross. That is gross. I get it. And if we’re, if we’re going to be together, we’ll get there.

[00:16:11] But I don’t want to see that right out of the gate. I don’t care how washboard abs you got, that’s not, that’s almost a left swipe. I mean, to me, like that’s not the dealio 

[00:16:25] Eming: [00:16:25] On average. Can you give me a sense of like of the guys you do sort of chat with on, on the app? Like, like how many of them get to something a little bit more deeper?

[00:16:35]Patricia: [00:16:35] .Yeah, well, I don’t know if Tinder where you want to go for deep. Uh, but here’s, I’m just gonna pull up the app while we’re here. I’m not gonna mention any names, but, uh, currently, currently let’s just roll up in there. Oh, we got somebody responding. So I’ve sent it to you…

[00:16:55]Eming: [00:16:55] In real time.

[00:16:56] Patricia: [00:16:56] Real time. Right. So I’ve thought out.

[00:16:58] So I’m not [00:17:00] that, I’m, trying to. Get a lot of batters in the batting box, but I have six up that I’ve either had conversations with and two that have come in because I guess we liked, and now I have the ability to chat them up. But of course you always have a fresh pool of folks. It always says 99 plus.

[00:17:17] So I’m imagining that. So what I’m looking for, and it usually is geographically, uh, enabled, you know, I w I don’t want to have to drive a hundred miles in unless it’s worth it for the first time. So I thought like a 20 to 50 mile spread includes everyone because I want to go, like, everyone can get on the bus.

[00:17:38] I like tech guys. Right. You know, every color under the rainbow. I like tech guys, but I don’t want them to techie cause I’m already techie. So if you get somebody techie in the room with you and you’re like, Oh no, what I find is that I really start gravitating toward earthy guys because earthy guys have  this depth.

[00:17:59] Like [00:18:00] maybe they’re a glass blower, you know, maybe they’re like, uh, because you remember I had a design studio in Atlanta for about over a decade . So my ex I was married before I was married for 11 years and I also have a 26 year old son. He was very creative and I found that fascinating because I am not.

[00:18:25] Uh, mean, you know, you all are super creative in and do a lot of creative things. I couple with someone who’s creative and there’s a ying to the yang, so I’m Leo he’s Scorpio. And those two things go together. So we fed off of each other. He would have the ideas, but he wasn’t always the one to bring them to market.

[00:18:45] So we had a company called, uh, uh, well, I won’t say the last name because then people know who I am. Uh, but it, uh, it was a consulting company and it was. The best time ever. So I kind of look for someone that I can partner with something [00:19:00] they’re doing, that I can help and assist to find where the yin and the yang meetup.

[00:19:05] But if they’re too techie, then, uh, it overshadows, uh, it’s, it’s almost like there’s a little bit of a power play there where they’re super smart and you’re super smart. And you got to find the place. Uh, where you all fit. So that’s, as far as I’ve gotten is been chats and making dates, but never facilitating, actually meeting other than taking it off Tinder and actually giving them your  your number.

[00:19:36] But then again, it’s still chats. I go, what’s the difference either do it on Tinder because it’s protecting me. Or do it on my phone where people could take your phone number and maybe throw it up into Google and see you’ve attached your phone number to like a meetup or like a LinkedIn or, and we all do it.

[00:19:53] So that’s the other thing, research. If someone tells me there, that’s in such  in this city, I’m going to Google [00:20:00] them back in the day. You could sit there and pull somebody’s credit report while you’re on the date. Like you, you know, let’s just get real because you can tell me all kinds of things, but it’s really what Google says.

[00:20:11] Hey, it’s a, we all do it. And I have had a lot of girlfriends, no lies and no judgments where they’re talking with somebody, they’re meeting someone and I go, have you Facebook them yet? Because if you go to their Facebook, you see their whole family, like they’re married. Right. And so we no judgements, but I don’t want to.

[00:20:31] Be with somebody who’s married. I think I lose my blessing. This let’s stick with the single guys when it comes to a point where I got a date married men, like, no, 

[00:20:43] Eming: [00:20:43] that’s solid. So in regards to you kind of talking about like ways to like, uh, date while, while still like being safe, is there any like other things that you kind of do like to make sure like.

[00:20:55] Either when meeting them or to talk, talking to them that like, you feel comfortable [00:21:00] moving forward with this person. 

[00:21:02] Patricia: [00:21:02] Well, first you have a girlfriend that knows where, where are you going? And there’s they say, there’s an app for that, but you just text someone going, Hey, by the way, I’m meeting this and such in Los Gatos.

[00:21:12] Um, if they see they’d want to do a hike right off the bat, I want to get coffee. It’d be where there’s like a ton of people. Right. Uh, I want to be. Uh, there, um, I would say that not revealing too much right out of the gate. Like things that you wouldn’t tell someone normally is sometimes a red flag for me, depending on what they reveal.

[00:21:44] Um, so most of the apps protect your identity and that’s good. If they start to rush you, like all of a sudden you get all this. And that you can’t do it on chat were the things they would say that might work at a bar setting doesn’t work over chat. [00:22:00] So all of a sudden they’re rushing to the coffee and rushing for the, to get you up.

[00:22:05] The guys know it’s the at bats, it’s that bats and women don’t do the at-bats as much the apps give us the app back. Let’s just be real. Like they might get to the next level, what’s it going to take? But how long do they have to chat to get you to do coffee with them in COVID days , right. And COVID days. So now it’s more about just clearing through, ask them some questions.

[00:22:30] Here’s the other thing I’ve noticed, what they’ll do is if they’ve made a date, I was trying to test to see if this person was doing it. We’ll make a date and then they’ll break it. Now maybe I, he might’ve thought that’s what I did. Like, he goes, Oh, we’re going to do something this weekend. I see it on a Saturday and Saturday with you Saturday, just seeing us, like, I’m just seeing this.

[00:22:53] And he was okay, that’s fine. What they want to see is the wig out factor if you’re going to wig out. [00:23:00] So they’ll do this on purpose case in point, girlfriend of mine, uh, is in Paris. Uh, no names will be mentioned and she’s on Tinder. Cause she wants to date somebody while she’s in Paris. And so she, this guy, she lines him up.

[00:23:12] He’s going to come see her. He knows where she’s at. Everything’s good. About an hour before they’re going to meet he cancels. Guess what she does. She wigs out, gee, this is called the wig out factor. So guys are going to test you. They don’t, you know, they, they want to meet you, but they don’t want the wig out.

[00:23:33] Eming: [00:23:33] It’s kind of sadistic. 

[00:23:35] Patricia: [00:23:35] Everybody does it. And, uh, sure enough, uh, comes to me in, uh, and so maybe, and I did check him out. He is a realtor. He is a realtor. I found out that much cause he told me by where he lived and he, I knew he had his first name popped into Google. There was this picture, it matched his Tinder.

[00:23:54] So I don’t know he’s been at this real estate company. So within three to five years, that’s a recent picture, [00:24:00] everything like that. So for me, that’s a green light. That’s a green light for me. I’ll go ahead. I’ll go ahead and, and go out with them in a crowded public space. Uh, Starbucks, a Peet’s , a Philz, let’s grab coffee, this walk around.

[00:24:16] Let’s chat it up. And then there’s still no pressure. Cause again, I’m a little older, not that I’ve dated that much or a lot since, uh, my divorce but I still am technically savvy to know there’s a certain. Uh, ethos of person that I also look for and I have to groove. And if I, and here’s the other thing too, no judgements for anyone listening, why I was formally married and I have a son.

[00:24:45] And so what I find is if the guys on their profile says they never been married, left swipe left swipe. Well, I don’t care how cute you are because here’s the deal. My son’s going to come in town or something’s going to happen, or I’ve got to go somewhere. And [00:25:00] people who were aren’t parents and parents won’t understand this won’t understand, and they will get all miffed.

[00:25:05] And I think that’s what this guy was actually doing. So the first weekend I couldn’t make it and I didn’t think anything of it. I always so nice. He’s going to do this next weekend, but then he did the same thing. That would have been a perfect wig out moment, but I’m not going to do it because I’m too smart for that.

[00:25:22] Like, I want to wait till the second or third date. 

[00:25:25] Eming: [00:25:25] So what, what is the, what is the end game with the wig out? I don’t understand that. They want to see how 

[00:25:33] Patricia: [00:25:33] you can wig out on something as simple as, Oh my God. The date we made is not going to work. You should be highly evolved as a woman. Most of us are, most of us chicas  have a lot on our plate, but we’re strong, you . Know, and we want to be smart Eagles.

[00:25:50] So I’m not going to wig out just because somebody changed plans because Lord knows I’ve done enough of that in my day. So it should be vis-a-vis. [00:26:00] Whereas if I’ve broken a date and I’ve said, Oh, sorry, I can’t make it. Or I didn’t see that text similarity. He should be able to come to me and go, Hey, I’ve got a good, big deal.

[00:26:11] He is a broker. Whether he’s got a big deal or not, something came up and he’s not going to be able to make our date. No perspective may not necessarily be reality, but I’m going to give him a hallway pass because guess what? I broke the deep before that the week. Before. So I shoot as a woman and we were trying to maybe all equal on the dating scene.

[00:26:32] Then I can’t have a wig out moment, although I will tell you, as soon as I saw that my first inclination was like, uh, later I unmatched from him on Tinder just to cut the ties there, but I left him on my phone. And I waited until the next day. Cause he, he responded to me on Friday night and I went on this kind of cheap dude.

[00:26:55] Like I was really looking forward to it, but whatever. Then the next morning I regrouped and I said, you know [00:27:00] what? You had to kind of, uh, have a self perspective that said, you know what, Patricia, if you were going to be real, you kind of broke the date that first time, but it took me until the morning to think about it.

[00:27:12] And I don’t, I’m trying not to do anything knee jerk. Like I try to think about it within 24 hours because things will be looking a little bit different the next day. And the next day I went, you know what? I don’t think I’m being fair. I don’t think I’m being fair. Cause I broke the first date. Now he can’t make it.

[00:27:29] Why am I going to get all jacked up about that? So I texted him. I said, you know what? No worries, no worries. Why don’t, why don’t we regroup? Why don’t we regroup the next weekend? And you won’t have this big busy, you know, busy schedule. And then you can tell me more about that deal and see if that deal went down.

[00:27:45] Might give us something else to talk about. So I kind of, when I took what they call the higher path. Instead of getting jacked up, Oh, I’m not going to have this date. Cause I already told some of my friends, I was going to go on a date. I was kind of excited about it, but now we’re not having it and [00:28:00] hopefully we’ll regroup, but again, I’ve not gotten a text back from him to regroup like, Ooh, let’s really do something next weekend.

[00:28:07] I didn’t get that either. So if you’re not a needy person and you’ve got your own things going on and I do, it’s a little bit harder to get involved because you do have so much more on your plate. Whereas some of these folks in here, it looks like it’s, uh, you’re being a weekend warrior. Like you’re just.

[00:28:27] You know, that’s when you have times you just get out there and do whatever. 

[00:28:31] Eming: [00:28:31] So based on what you just said, um, I’m curious, um, dating as a whole, like now with social media and apps and Tinder, has, do you feel like dating has become, like, there’s more of like a weird game to it or is it kind of the same thing just evolved with, with technology?

[00:28:49] Cause it seems like, like you’re like that’s a straight up mind game. The wig out thing. So this is, has, has the wig out thing [00:29:00] always been a thing or is that, or, or, or has the, the, the, the process of dating just got . More of the same, or just more evolved 

[00:29:11] Patricia: [00:29:11] technology as a technology has come for someone that has known dating before internet, before cell phones, before, you know, like when you would call on the landline.

[00:29:23] Okay. Now, technology, what allows us to do is hide. And you don’t really have to show your true self. So chatting on an app is great, but you don’t really know, like it’s a hot picture, but you don’t know if the guy’s just on his couch with a beer belly like up in the woods somewhere. Like you don’t know it’s whatever.

[00:29:44] So for me technology, whereas it makes it easier to get to more people. And there has been successes and I’ve seen people who really matched up. Did did their due diligence and took the time to, and they say you got a date, like 40 people got  go on a date every night, every night. [00:30:00] And it’s because it’s a numbers game and I’m demand gen.

[00:30:02] So I know it’s a numbers game. I will say, you know, this is my personal demand generation. Uh, but it’s. Ability the technology, whereas it’s given us the ability to get in front of more people and people we wouldn’t necessarily have had the opportunity had we just walked into a bar or walk into a restaurant, see our friends, which is usually how you would bump into someone or by the pool or whatever.

[00:30:24] Now technology gives us chance to get in front of them, but it doesn’t feel real. Like it doesn’t like chats or just chats. I’ve never seen you. I can’t really, and it feels kind of fake for those of us that are more real, no judgements. Uh, it’s ability. Just know that you’re chatting with some guy you see his picture, he looks hot.

[00:30:45] It feels like you’re kind of dating while COVID is trying to figure out when it’s gonna go away. You know,  

[00:30:52]Eming: [00:30:52] So now during COVID. Do you feel like, because, because of technology and because you’re using an app for this, do you feel like [00:31:00] you have more control over how much of yourself you’re putting out there?

[00:31:03] When, when, when people are like looking at you or, you know, or swiping through you 

[00:31:10] Patricia: [00:31:10] super swiping, I don’t feel as connected. Like it’s just. Doesn’t feel like I’m going on. I started at the beginning of January. So what does this into February? So we’re getting into March, right? Most of what I’ve seen, um, is.

[00:31:32] Uh, just preliminary little chats. It’s I think the guys are on it because they maybe aren’t in the bars. And so they’ve got up and more guys that are telling me, this is my first time on here. And you look at their picture and you’re like, Ooh, I can believe that. Uh, you know, they’re not using, they’re not, they’re not, they’re on they’re new.

[00:31:52] They’re, they’re frustrated that they’re having to use a dating app. That’s all we have right now. So there’s actually more. [00:32:00] Guys that I would have dated on it for the first time. And they’re finding it very frustrating because they want to be in the bar. They want to be at the restaurant. They want to go out with their friends so they can meet people.

[00:32:12] I don’t even know how the millennials are doing it, but for those of us a little bit older, we’re smarter. We’re we’re we’re savvy. We’re. Uh, we use the chat, but I mean, I don’t even use messenger on Facebook. Like I don’t need like one more thing to go check on. Right? Like I I’m already so entranced with tech that I have to use at work.

[00:32:35] Then I told you this too, you know, I have to be such an extrovert in marketing, but I’m such an introvert at home and it takes a special person to understand that I have to present. In the professional world, but as I push, as I come back into my personal world after five o’clock or whenever, um, I don’t feel like I need those.

[00:32:57] So these apps in with COVID, it’s [00:33:00] actually giving me the ability to get through many more people that I would be interested in how we take it to that next level. Let’s say COVID, let’s say miracle upon miracles in March. COVID goes away. Let’s just say it did in a fantasy world. And in that fantasy world, we would, we would be able to step back into the restaurants and the bars and go out with our friends, how we usually meet folks.

[00:33:24] And it’s just about to be spring. This is when it starts and people are going to start taking more chances because they’re just dying to get out there. And I’m wondering more chances. This, I think is the warmup, or if you will, the foreplay, right. Of getting someone on, uh, that you’re interested enough, but how long you want to chat with someone not having a live meeting?

[00:33:48] You there’s no connections. I can’t tell you how many people, how many guys and I had on Tinder that I chatted up and I go, man, this guy isn’t telling me, he’s deep, I’ve asked some kind of penetrating questions that isn’t about the [00:34:00] answers about the questions you asked. Right? So what I keep finding is just super superficial.

[00:34:06] It’s it’s a couple of ass out that never materialized. It’s a lot of chatting that even the guys are. Fricking frustrated over as well. I’m sure as the women, and then it’s the guys that you could smell from a mile away, it’s got to speed you through that are going to get you on that third date. That’s got to then never call you ghost to, and they’re onto the next one.

[00:34:28] Not that that’s ever happened to me. I read about it in a magazine, but 

[00:34:35] Eming: [00:34:35] I will say that ghosting sucks. 

[00:34:37] Patricia: [00:34:37] Ghosting sucks man., 

[00:34:38] because you know, and you just, you got to get over it, but then again, If there, if that is the skills in which they feel like they can’t pull their big boy pants on, it’s how you look. We dated a couple of times, I find you attractive, but I don’t think it’s a match if it’s going that way.

[00:34:54] The other thing I will have to tell you is the honesty by which the guys will tell you [00:35:00] they are in supposedly open relationship. That’s the, other thing I’m seeing. A lot of the other men straight up will tell you that, uh, they, uh, Or not they’re monogamous open, open, monogamous. I don’t know what they’re saying.

[00:35:18] You’re with someone, but you can never be monogamous. Like that’s. I don’t know what that is. I don’t, I don’t. And maybe that’s true. I guess I’ve seen enough. Sapiosexual like, what the hell is that might have to look that up on Google? Like, I don’t know, see, or I don’t know what that means, dude. I’d have to Google it, but don’t throw all kinds of acronyms on me.

[00:35:41] Like, I’m basic, like I’m old school and we want to just find what we find. And I found my, uh, my. First and only husband at a pool party pool party, and they were mixing, you know, what they did back in the day, took a long [00:36:00] extension cord from their apartment and ran it all the way up to the pool. So they could put the margarita blender right next to the pool.

[00:36:06] Okay. Like these guys had. Forethought, they plan their assault. They got everybody drunk around the pool and then they separate the weak ones from the herd. Right? Totally it even, I will go as far as to say the person that I ended up being with actually had a girlfriend at the time to where he invited me at the same party that the girlfriend who he didn’t invite showed up.

[00:36:30] Showed up that day to the point you’re sitting on the couch with them and she comes rolling in because he’s forgotten to tell her he’s now dating the young chick and no longer dating her.

[00:36:48] Yeah. 

[00:36:50] Eming: [00:36:50] Um, you said, um, one thing about the app was that it’s kind of like, it’s not. There’s like, there’s like a [00:37:00] distance too. Right? You don’t feel a connection, right? 

[00:37:02] Patricia: [00:37:02] Yeah. 

[00:37:05] Eming: [00:37:05] So how do you, what do you do to make up for that? Like, like, is, are there ways that you have been able to emotionally like reach out to people in ways that feel real for you?

[00:37:16] Or are you just going to be like, you know what, I’m going to wait until COVID is over and then I’m going to go to a bar and I’m going to be able to like talk to someone face to face at some point without a mask, eventually hopefully knock on wood. 

[00:37:28] Patricia: [00:37:28] It’s it’s both of those things in different ways. So I want to keep, I want to keep Tinder going because I feel like it keeps me in the game.

[00:37:35] Right. I’m still, I’m not chatting with any guys unless I’m on an app. Right. Or maybe you’re bumping into people like I’ve been bumped on and people are whole foods and all of a sudden they’re more apt to chat you up. I had this one guy kind of follow me for a little bit. And I was like stalky kind of stuff.

[00:37:50] And I thought it was kind of cute. He was a cute guy, but I was like, dude, just talk to me. Don’t be, you know, every aisle I, there you are

[00:38:00] [00:38:00] a little and he was cute, but you’re like, dude, you got to like stand up, like put your, put your big boy pants on and come over and talk. Or, or if women go over and I’ve heard this too, if you go over to them first, you’re much more attractive. Because you’ve not lowered the bar form, but then you didn’t get shot down with eyes or used to get shot down all the time.

[00:38:20] But women aren’t, you know, we put so much work into getting out there that we expect them to come over, but it’s hard if you’re in a herd nickname with women, you know, but I’ve also heard it. I go over to a bunch of men together, like four buddies, right? The first guy that talks to me, me totally likes me.

[00:38:38] If I go over Hey guys, what’s going on tonight? Just like surf their circle. Usually the first guy that talks to you likes you. Usually, or they agreed, like, see that girl over there when she comes up. I got her, unless he already laid claim.

[00:38:56]. You’re coming into the bar and guys go, Oh, I saw you from afar. [00:39:00] Bullshit. We sussed you out. The moment we got in that bar, we had you. You know, there, uh, there’s comedian on either Netflix or Amazon prime and she’s an elder millennial you’ll find her because she uses that terminology.

[00:39:13] It’s like a hashtag. So if you go hashtag elder millennial, and she says, you know, she did the thing on that for the boat in which she said was true. Was she said, What would you guys rather want the woman that’s powerful and got the job that she’s, you know, together. And she doesn’t have daddy issues and she doesn’t have, you know, she’s got her own money, but she’s going so fast.

[00:39:37] The guys are like. There’s no way, like she’s old. She’s got everything she needs. Why would she want me? They go, or, or the little wallflower that’s just like shivering in the corner. You know, it’s the other flip side of the corn that just brings in all the creepy guys because they go, Oh, here’s somebody, you know, Yeah, I don’t want to say easy prey, but [00:40:00] definitely not the more confident of the women.

[00:40:02] So there’s that going on too and again, uh, some of the, uh, ways women can protect themselves is to use these apps that masks your identity, be on the lookout for guys pushing you too soon, or trying to tell you this, this, this, or getting too possessive too early, like if you’re on your third chat and they’re questioning why you had to go to the grocery store, that’s a left, that’s a left swipe.

[00:40:27] Like that, but younger women won’t know that they’re like, Oh, he likes me. Look, he’s being protective girl, because protective later turns into something different, unless it’s, if he’s rushing and you were obviously probably had some chicas too, that, you know, you do see it, but COVID is just erased. Any playbook.

[00:40:46] Because women won’t come out. At least if they’re like me, you know, you’re established, you have your own home, your car or your money or whatever. And I think I go to the gym, like, I think I’m good. You know, they [00:41:00] will say, you know, whatever. Uh, but I’m, I’m looking for something deeper, but. With the guys, you kind of have to have this package.

[00:41:07] I don’t know, just to be healthy. That’s the key where we all come in all shapes and sizes, but there is a look, I guess, you know, I, at this stage, I want to find something deep. I don’t know if an app get me that, but bumping into somebody at a restaurant and our bar. Um, it’s just doesn’t feel real. 

[00:41:28] Eming: [00:41:28] So your, your feeling is like, The thing you want, which is  which is a deeper relationship is not possible through, through, through Tinder, during COVID correct?

[00:41:40] Patricia: [00:41:40] Yeah. During COVID cause on Tinder, if this hadn’t been COVID, you’re like two times on Tinder and you’re already meet now for drink. That’s usually how it is then you can, because what I say is don’t invite people to dinner. Invite  them for coffee. You don’t want to spend three hours with somebody, you know, there’s no long-term potential even, you know, or, or a friendship.

[00:41:59] Let’s just [00:42:00] start there. You know, why do three hours when someone, we can just roll up on a Peet’s do five minutes. Oh my God. Look at the time. 

[00:42:08] Eming: [00:42:08] So, I guess my last question I have for you then is if, if you’re not feeling, if you’re not getting what you want out of this app, and you’re not finding the deep things that you were seeking in  people, why keep doing the app?

[00:42:23] Patricia: [00:42:23] Because in your mind, you feel like you’re putting some time on the board. At least the hopes is, and there’s a lot of people that date and get thrown back in the pile. You got to keep digging. I wouldn’t say necessarily, uh, a needle in a haystack, but if you do your due diligence and you go through 40 days, they say 40 days, you got to go on 40 dates.

[00:42:45] You finally will arrive with meeting someone that you’re like. He’s kind of interesting. Some of them. You would’ve never thought I think your story to, uh, Eming uh, the way you met your partner. It was [00:43:00] very, didn’t it just catch you off guard. Like this is you wouldn’t. If you thought back before you met your partner and you went, Hmm.

[00:43:08] This would be my dream guy and have a poster up in your room. She didn’t have a poster up in the room about that dream guy. You rolled up on something and you went, what the frick is this? 

[00:43:21] Eming: [00:43:21] Do you know what, what happened? The actual story? 

[00:43:25] Patricia: [00:43:25] You don’t have to. Yeah.  Here’s how I remember it is like he got, he was already dressed up because he had a photo shoot.

[00:43:33] Eming: [00:43:33] So, um, me and my partner as, you know, work together once upon a time. And, uh, we have a lot of mutual friends who we all work together obviously. And, um, one day our mutual friend who was known as both like equally, very long time, um, he looks at me and he goes, you know, that I won’t use the word he used, you know, that he likes you. Right. And I [00:44:00] just like. What, what do you mean? 

[00:44:05] Yeah, it was, and then that, that just kind of bounced around my head for like a whole weekend. And I was like, does he, like, what do you mean? What did we talk about? And then, and then I, and then I eventually like, Sort of asked him. I don’t know. It was, it was a weird anyways, but so I definitely have never had the conventional dating experience.

[00:44:25] I, I, uh, when I first lived in my first apartment, um, I was already dating my partner and yeah. Um, I was the only female in my apartment who was, who was in a thing with someone, which was very rare for me because usually I’m like, I’m the friend who doesn’t have someone and that’s usually how it was so weird to have people who like we’re looking and we’re on like Tinder.

[00:44:49] And I was like, what is this? How does this work? I’m, I kind of wish I had that experience just to kind of know, but I’m like, should I have had that experience? Like, would it have helped me in the long [00:45:00] run? Like, I don’t know. That’s why, that’s why I’m so curious about your experience because it’s like, you’ve, you’ve like you’ve used the app, like, you know, the do’s the, don’ts the, the red flag warnings blinking in your face, like, you know, so I’m really, really curious about what your experience was for someone like myself who has zero experience in that particular area.

[00:45:21] I’m really, I’m really thankful that you had such insight 

[00:45:25] Patricia: [00:45:25] And you have to remember, I started back in the day, the first app was This, this will date me for sure, for sure.  In the nineties, you know, when went through my divorce and all of a sudden I was like, okay, well, I’ve got to get out here.

[00:45:38] I was younger. I had a young son and I thought, okay, You know, we’re being told, we have to couple up couple up couple up, like, you know, you hear that as a young person growing up and sometimes you don’t, but I did. And then youth proceed that you have to couple up again, there was this, I remember having this pressure.

[00:45:57] Oh, I’ve got a son now I’ve got a couple up, a couple up. [00:46:00] And I thought I got to a point where I would, you know, what, why.  You know, people, people who are married that are, my friends will go well, Patricia don’t you want to be married again? And I go, no. And here’s why, because I can call the shots. Like I can do what I want.

[00:46:14] I can date too. And if I get with someone who I feel like it’s a good match, and in my mind, I’m not even looking for a partner. I think it would be really cool. That a lot of my friends have these friends with benefits where they have their own home. You have their own home. You you only couple up on nights.

[00:46:32] You want to get together. If you get sick of each other, you can go home. And they say that is a new regime. The new regime is not cohabitating, but just everyone having their own house and just getting together whenever you feel like it. And it’s a little sad, but more than not, those of us around my age are relegated to these.

[00:46:51] Different relationships. You know, in, in some of my girlfriends were married for 20 years and they’re lost, they’re lost because they don’t have that [00:47:00] solid. And what I tell them is, look, you are your own relationship. You are enough, you are enough okay. It’s you don’t find your identity by grouping up with someone, you have your identity already.

[00:47:10] And you add that to the relationship to make it a better place. Right?

[00:47:17] It we’re older Chicas, so we get it. So what I try to do is send the elevator back down and try to share some of this with some of the younger Chicas and just go look. You’ve been sold. You’ve got a couple up or you’ve been sold. You gotta be with someone. You don’t have to be with a man to be with, you know, to be someone you need to be someone already before you want a couple of irrespective of where you take that.

[00:47:39] Um, and I think that those of us that orbit. Uh, older that are using these apps. Do  find the ability to have more conversations with men? Yes. Check that box. You do find the ability to then filter through those folks and you think, well, somebody has got to pop out at the end, but I am like two months knock on [00:48:00] wood, honey.

[00:48:00] You know? I’ve been single for a while, but by choice, by choice. And it doesn’t mean I haven’t had boyfriends that I haven’t dated one in particular that I spent a lot of time. And then I thought it was going somewhere and didn’t, and maybe I should have asked better questions. Um, I didn’t, uh, and that’s a learning opportunity.

[00:48:17] Which I will definitely use moving forward. So you don’t want you. What I find is there’s a lot of angst with my girlfriends that are putting time into people that are never going to couple up and they know it, and here’s what they say, Oh, I could change him. I’m just going to spend time with them and they’ll see how amazing I am.

[00:48:33] And a light will shine down from the clouds and he’ll understand that I’m the one for him. Bullshit. That is not going to happen. You’re little. You know, Prince on the little white horse is not going to ride up. What you need to do is get on your own fricking horse and go find the people that you want to be with.

[00:48:51] And whether you get coupled up or not, you are enough and whatever you think your lifestyle is, you are right. You are right. That is your [00:49:00] lifestyle. And just because you’re not in a relationship or with a couple does not make you any less of a person, but there is a stigma in even, I would say, even. Now when you’re not with someone, are you seeing it, that one person sitting alone eating by themselves by the way, would never be me?

[00:49:17] Uh, because I just don’t go there. Like I do take out, like, I don’t have to sit there anymore. Right. But you know, it’s hard. It is hard. And I find it, hopefully if anyone hears this and submits their little information, uh, there is light. And I think you just need to be a strong individual and keep driving in the thing that.

[00:49:37] We have, we have a really killer family. We’ve got lots of really, probably cool friends. We beat, you know, we’re in a family, that’s super cares. Not, you know, some people may not have that. And so you do feel solid. Hell if I got a cat, I would be done like I have no, but if I did, I want to 

[00:49:56] Eming: [00:49:56] join the dark side already become a cat lady [00:50:00] too. 

[00:50:02]Patricia: [00:50:02] . I mean, I love your cat. I love your, your cat is super special. And I, I think I screenshot it, something that looks like your cat. He was so good. I think it was the Zen cat was the Zen . So I’m not, and here’s the other Chicas that I am not, and I should be, but I’m not, I am not jaded. I think there’s still good guys out there.

[00:50:24] I have dated really great guys had really great guy friends, but this is COVID like, I barely even seen him family. Okay. So chatting with somebody online, uh, Tinder, chatting with somebody on plenty of fish, Facebook, wherever you’re at seems to be like you release moving the ball down the field. So when this does open up, if someone does pop out, the other side, you’ll have someone or it’s going to open up and you’re going to meet it.

[00:50:49] It’ll end up. I put a lot of time into these apps, but I ended up in the first time I walked into the bar. It’s always when you least expect it. It’s always, when you, if you try hard to find someone, [00:51:00] you will not find anyone. And the other thing is there’s a stipulation. If you see someone successful to say, you know, in my wildest dreams, I’m a, I’m a Hottie.

[00:51:11] Maybe I am in my dreams. Maybe not for other people. There’s also a fear factor of guys wanting to come up. Cause they think you’re already with someone. They don’t know, like I wear rings on my middle fingers to dispel the belief that I am in any kind of a committed relationship. But my girlfriend say, take off all your rings, take off all of them.

[00:51:31] Do not have any rings on your fingers. And I go, well, dude, come on. That’s like a false positive. Like if they want to know, they can walk over this the same with being in a group of women, men don’t want to get shot down and they’re always getting shot down and here’s four chicas and one’s hot. But he doesn’t want to go over to, you know, and the other girls are like, Oh, we’re just coming out.

[00:51:48] Like you don’t go out with your chicas just to go out with your chicas is I can talk to you any time it’s to go out. And then we say, you gotta break herd. You gotta like, do, do a circle of the bar. So break [00:52:00] herd so that the guy feels comfortable enough to go over and talk to you. Right. And so again, you know, we’re older, it’s a different mindset than what the millennials are going through and they’re dating, they’re hating it because they’re having to do the same thing and they can’t get out or they’re sneaking or they’re, you know, driving two cars and you open up the back end, you sit there and talk in a circle or something.

[00:52:20] So it’s, it’s even hard. It was harder before COVID to try to date and these apps help us get there. It’s kinda like we’re using zoom. Right. But again, it doesn’t, it, it is still only what the person wants to reveal. So you’re still kind of stuck behind technology. Static pictures because Tinder doesn’t show you live stuff.

[00:52:39] Unless there’s some stuff in there. And I have the free version. I don’t have the paid version. Right. So there’s only so much I can do, but even me, I don’t want to spend every night having to be finished. Chats, but then you got to do the time. It’d be the same thing if you were in the, uh, in the bars or in the restaurants.

[00:52:59] Um, [00:53:00] so I don’t know when COVID lifts and hopefully it’ll be earlier this year than later. And we do outside dining is available. Right. So my girlfriends and I will go out. It’s the only place to get seen. I took my nephew the other day, went to Mulago Rose here in rapid city, which was great, but loss, uh, Saint Carlos is full of people being outside.

[00:53:23] But again, I don’t want to roll up by myself just to sit in a bar area or not have a meal. Right. It just. It just says something and then I should feel more comfortable about doing that. I know a lot of women that do just not my MO I’d rather be with somebody because it makes me feel more comfortable.

[00:53:38] Right. 

[00:53:40] Eming: [00:53:40] Well, I think you just dropped the mic on this conversation, honestly. Thank you for providing such, such insightful thoughtfulness to this. I really appreciate it. You really, you really went deep and I really, I really liked where you went with that. Um, but thank you again so much for coming on. I hope you’re willing to come [00:54:00] back on in the future for outside of dating other, other topics of interests that. That inspire or make you want to talk for an hour? 

[00:54:11] Patricia: [00:54:11] I will be there. You tell me what it is and we’ll break it down. 

[00:54:17] Eming: [00:54:17] Well. Okay. I want to thank you again for coming on. I also want to thank our audience and our listeners and our supporters. Thank you, , our, um, our hosts, our usual host.

[00:54:26] Who’s not here on Russell Morse shoutout to him, wherever he may be. Um, again, thank you all. And. And be well and Kwest On on, we’ll see you guys next week. This episode of Kwest on Media’s Margin Call was produced in Richmond, California.

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